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Sexual Identity

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Why do you think there is so much confusion surrounding these terms?

 

Gay itself is the term we are trying to define. Or undefine. I don't know.

 

Lust is a term we understand but cannot pinpoint where it originates or when. We vaguely understand it is part of the human instinct of survival and reproduction.

 

Attraction.. REALLY complicated. What is attraction? Where does it lie on the spectrum between "I want to have sex with you" and "I think you look nice"? Does one necessarily have a connection with the other? If not, what IS the spectrum?

 

Questions, questions..

 

Woot 100th poster. :D

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Gay: eh, I stick with defining it as - "strong attraction to the same gender". The rest such as, "having occasional straight sex", etc. can be left alone as they are subjective.

 

Lust origin: bef. 900; ME luste, OE lust; c. D, G lust pleasure, desire; akin to ON lyst desire; see list4

 

attraction: Imo, attraction IS the spectrum between when you want to have sex with someone and when you just find the person attractive.

 

extremely vague ordering-

very strong = love perhaps. something like ellen/portia who are in for the long haul (and i wish them the best of luck in staying together happy. married for 2 years already <3)

strong attraction = sex

middle attraction = crushing

weak attraction = find girl/guy cute

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Okay,I must stick my nose in again.Lust?I am queer,and have a trace of erotophobia,if ever heard of it.You can't say I lust for sex,and I am virgin.To make a clear thing of what I want to say:

Queer community has it's perverts as the straight community.As I want just a nice person to spend my time with,give it my love,and try to make him happy as much as I can,same you will find similar wishes in straight community.You can't include all the people into a group/category,that's why I want to put aside labeling.Get what I want to say?

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@kenneth: I have no idea where you're going with this.

 

Are you trying to say lust is bad?

 

If so:

There's nothing perverted or wrong with lust (the definition I'm using is "intense sexual desire or appetite"). What you do with it might be an issue [for example raping a person because you lusted after them is bad], but that doesn't make it bad in itself.

 

For many couples, a sex life is a big part of their relationship. I expect many non-arranged couples would fall apart if they were forced into a celibate relationship. Lusting after your partner would certainly help keep the ole sex life churning lol.

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@klaus: even queers will get the lust. If you claimed for being a gay, then you don't have to be a virgin to have lust towards those males. Just as you were saying, it's just the same as straights do. The matters just which gender it is.

 

Also, we're speaking about gay/lesbian/straight 'labels', are we not? Since they're especialized to separate ppl from which sex they're having lusts, then the similarities within queers and straights that you mentioned are biased.

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There is a stereotype that all homosexuals are "sex-fiends". Kenneth is just trying to put that myth to rest, saying that there are no more homosexual sex-fiends than there are straight sex-fiends.

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Well, put it this way. If someone used magic and turned me into a cat, I wouldnt be a real cat just like they wouldnt be a real man / woman.

 

 

 

Do you think being sexually attracted to the same gender but not emotionally attracted makes you gay/lesbian? Vice Versa?

 

I think it makes you gay / lesbian for sure. Even if you got a sex change, you'd still be a man, no matter how much you tried to change your outer appearance. You're still not going to have periods or bear children.

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Before Answering these questions, here is something that just came into my mind:

All these questions talk about the difference between being gay or straight (not in a discriminating way). I there really is a difference, and if gays would act different from straight persons, this would make one of both more "normal" then the other. (I am sure you didn't mean it this way, it's just something that came into my mind)

I believe that gay and straight people are EXACTLY the same, so you can't say: "this and that me gay" or "this behaviour defines me as straight".

Some people like men, others like women, that's it for me

 

"If a wo/man and a wo/man are in love, and one of the wo/men gets a sex change and becomes the opposite gender, are they now straight, or gay/lesbian?"

 

In my opinion, surgery for a sex change only makes you look like the opposite sex, but you stay the same sex. A man will never have an uterus, and a women will never have a fully functioning organ, to name some examples. Also, the hormone levels are different.

 

 

"Do you think being sexually attracted to the same gender but not emotionally attracted makes you gay/lesbian? Vice Versa?"

 

I'll contradict my first statement and try to answer this one:

 

first of all: in puberty (until the age of 18 ) many boys feel attracted to the same sex. In most cases this stops at the age of 18. Some straight men have been in this situation, and some gay men haven't, it's a perfectly normal process.

 

to answer the real question: physically, I feel more attracted to men myself, but I could never have a real relationship with one, because I could only live together with a women (in general, they are more comprehensive, better listeners, ...)

I don't see myself as gay, but that's a personal view, and not really an argument

 

"What do you think decides someone's sexuality- Self identity or social identity (What others think or what they think)? What if the person identifies them as something due to their lack of knowledge (e.g; because they kissed a girl in truth or dare, they are completely lesbian even though they are in no way attracted to girls)?"

 

A mix of both. The way the human body and mind works didn't change over the last 2000 years, to call a number. Yet, now there are more gay men (who openly admit it or stay secret about it)then 1000 years ago. Because being gay was not an option in that time, I believe that many men that would have been gay in our society, would be straight there, because they just didn't realize that falling in love with someone of the same sex is an option. If nobody speaks about it or admits he is gay, people won't see it as a possibility as fast. But there have always been gay people and their always will be, and I think that has a lot to see with Self identity.

In short: self identity influences the fact that you are gay or not, but society influences your self identity.

 

 

I really learned alot about my own point of view about this subject, good questions ^^

 

AS usual when I explain something, my post is WAY to long

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Well, I can surely tell you that I am more gay than straight because it is aroused at some boys, which I find cute or handsome. And not just that, the thing that I have been asked if I consider myself a man, or told that I act like a woman at times makes you think. Sexually attraction is one, emotionally attraction is number two. You don't actually to be sexually attracted to a person, but you can find it cute/handsome, and be emotionally attracted to him/her, and have an intimate relationship with him/her.

 

There is also the stereotype thing. There are also very pervert or lusting people everywhere, the sex addicted persons, because I can't count how many dirty things can a man and woman / man and man / woman and man / other can do together. But that doesn't mean all are like that. There will also be people and people, some which accept it and some which don't. There will always be prejudices. To me, love was always something which is born if you feel like a important bond between you and a person. I agree there are more types of attraction, but sincerely response, do you think that you will never be sexually attracted to a person in your life? Think twice...

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What about intersex people? How do they know which gender identity to take? After all, most forms only have male/female blanks, and no 'other'.

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@kirroha: XXY is still a male body, albeit a defective male body but still male. Defective XX body is still a defective female technically.

 

However, whatever the person identifies ie do they feel like man, woman, or intersex is up to the person. Some feel strongly they are men, so they are men. Some feel strongly they are women so they are women. And you have a subgroup that feels they are intersex so they are intersex.

 

As for forms: Those things are discriminating anyway. For example, what about those race boxes? Are you chinese, caucasion, black, or mexican?

 

Many forms put it as you can only pick one. But there are many people of very mixed heritage so they are forced into a box on those forms to.

 

So if you have a form like that, you adapt, protest, and do whatever you can to get acknowledged correctly.

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This is not in the same vein as what everyone else has been talking about recently, but there is a double standard when it comes to sexual orientation. Many people find males attracted to other males disgusting, while the same people find lesbian relationships "hot". If a guy says another guy is hot, then he is immediately gay in the eyes of others. If a girl says another girl is hot, it means nothing. Another example: Katy Perry's hit song "I Kissed a Girl". If that song had been "I Kissed a Boy" by some male artist, it would not have been a hit, and the mild controversy surrounding Katy Perry's song would have escalated. Why is there this double standard? Is it okay? For the gay people here, how does it make you feel? It's just something to think about. :P

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Double Standard: cuz women are sex objects and succubus. They got wiles and are teases. Even if a woman say another woman's hot, or are together with a woman, they are simply waiting for the right guy to turn them straight.

 

Men must be macho macho. You're not macho if you act like a girl and being with another man = being a wuss and 'a girl'.

 

Okay or not: Course its not okay. It demeans women [no surprise there] and adds another layer of gay/men hate. Our society reinforces this image that a man must be macho, strong, and masculine. This means they are less likely to speak up if they get rape, abused, etc. which happens just as often if not more than women abuses. Better stop before I rant my head off bout this.

 

Though I find it interesting that you're observation is polar opposite to what's happening in the manga field. Yaoi fans absolutely dwarf yuri fans and are extremely vocal about how much they find lesbian media disgusting while they rave about gay manga.

 

Personally for me: At the risk of sounding like a hypocrite, I prefer lesbian media to gay media. I don't find gay stuff disgusting. If I did, my sister and I would have killed each other long ago since she likes yaoi lol. If asked why, I wouldn't have a good answer besides replying its like asking why blue is my favorite color.

 

BUT, if presented with good yaoi stuff I certainly would read/watch it. My sister is generally the provider for such stuff. I just wouldn't go out of my way to find gay stuff like I would with yuri. *shrugs*

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I don't know how much can be said on a PG forum without moderation, but for every aspect of society, there is a biological explanation. There is a biological reason why homosexuality among males receives a different social response from homosexuality among females.

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My thoughts on gays go about this far:

I don't care.

 

 

Thats it. I literally don't care, I'm not super progressive, but I also don't care that there are gays.

 

From a scientific perspective, some breeds of mice have increasingly large gay populations when overpopulation occurs.

 

I've met some very fruity lesbians, and conversely some very manly homo men. If you believe they don't exist, take my friend Zeke's recommendation and go look around some of the gay bar in georgia.

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Plus, the feminine guys and manly/tomboy girls aren't really have to be gays or lesbians. They may act like whatever they like to, but it has nothing to do with which gender they'd ATTRACTED to, unless they're being manly/feminine to get a like-position in replacement of 'girls' among gays, or 'guys' among lesbians by acted in that way.

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it's like you're seeing manly girls and girly guys acted in that way BECAUSE they're gays or lesbian. If a girl is tomboy, then she did it because she has a feminine girlfriend. Then a guy with girly behaviours because he had something with another male.

 

Some gays and lesbians do that, but it doesn't mean that every tomboys girls and feminine guys are queer, nor every gays or lesbis do that.

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Here it's pretty accepted as well, I mean they only talk about it behind your back (but they would do that as well if your hair looks messy, or about anything really), but everyone's ok with it.

Unless of course that you're a stereotype wearing bags and eyeliner.

 

I think that stereotypes are ok if it is something you have grown into it because you feel better that way, and not because you have to since you want to look like this, or act like that.

 

If you are a stereotype just to be a stereotype, you're only lying to yourself

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